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Jonathan 
Beta Testers 
Joined: 07 Sep 2008 Location: SoCal Online Status: Offline Posts: 1237 |
 Quote Reply
 Posted: 15 Dec 2008 at 12:52am |
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I'll be the first to admit I am not an expert (or even an amateur) with regards to electricity. I just know that I tend to blow electrical things up when I mess with them and that my water lights show kept tripping the GFCI's. Water would seep through the electrical tape covering the extension cord connections that would end up partially submerged. My power strips never went off though. Even if you know what you are doing, I still think it's a good idea to err on the side of caution.
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~Jonathan
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bdkeen
Beta Testers
Joined: 31 Dec 2007 Location: Easton,PA Online Status: Offline Posts: 380 |
Quote Reply
Posted: 14 Dec 2008 at 8:16pm |
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The purpose of GFCI isn't to protect electronic equipment. Their primary purpose is to offer personal protection against electrical shock wherever there is the potential for contact between a person and an electrical appliance. So if I'm stupid enough to go grabbing wires in the rain then I probably deserve what I might get. Only bypassed the GFIs because I'm also providing other forms of protection on the circuits feeding the controllers as well. Bypassing is temporary until properly functioning GFCI's are installed. Tested the GFIs in question and should trip when a drop off in the current is equivalent to about 5 milliamperes (the way a GFCI works) and they were tripping at lower. I have others that don't give me the problem.
We normally don't get that much water this time of the year as we did when major storm system moved up the northeast. Never had any problems with the snow.
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Jonathan
Beta Testers
Joined: 07 Sep 2008 Location: SoCal Online Status: Offline Posts: 1237 |
Quote Reply
Posted: 14 Dec 2008 at 7:36pm |
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That's a big risk you are taking.
 GFCI's exist for a reason, and if they trip that's also for a reason. Bypassing them because they trip is, IMHO, asking for trouble. Is it more important for the show to run, or to prevent your boards from accidentally being fried? Unless the news crew was filming, I know what I'd choose. Good luck mate; I hope it works out for you!
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~Jonathan
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bdkeen
Beta Testers
Joined: 31 Dec 2007 Location: Easton,PA Online Status: Offline Posts: 380 |
Quote Reply
Posted: 14 Dec 2008 at 5:06pm |
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GFI's and I have been beating each other up - well we were anyway. Ended up routing around the GFI breakers.. We've been running rain or no rain. Ohter than a weak breaker in a surge bar tht kept tripping everything has been running excellent.
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Pony_God
Senior Member 
Joined: 01 Sep 2008 Location: Naples, FL Online Status: Offline Posts: 551 |
Quote Reply
Posted: 12 Dec 2008 at 11:42am |
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Nope, Target el-cheapos I believe. At least they are the mini/micros from a local chain. Some are from Lowes though. It's strill really odd that it's primarily the two controllers. Not quire sure what's going in with them.
The other three that have LEDs are fine.
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LightsOnLogan
Admin Group 
Joined: 11 Oct 2007 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3187 |
Quote Reply
Posted: 12 Dec 2008 at 9:21am |
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If those are the 2008 CDI LEDs in the longer counts, any of mine that are "superstranded" (braided together with other colors on other channels) act crazy whenever it gets foggy out. It seems they "see" the neighboring strands (other colors) braided with them in the "superstrand" and start glitching accordingly.
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Pony_God
Senior Member
Joined: 01 Sep 2008 Location: Naples, FL Online Status: Offline Posts: 551 |
Quote Reply
Posted: 12 Dec 2008 at 8:14am |
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It's been really rainy here yesterday and today. The only problem we have is a single GFCI that keeps tripping, even though that's the dryest outlet/wires/controller in the entire yard!
I just re-routed around the GFCI and everything runs.
Although, our LEDs are on about 80% on the one controller now. Humidity must be doing something with the power leak in the board.
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Jonathan
Beta Testers
Joined: 07 Sep 2008 Location: SoCal Online Status: Offline Posts: 1237 |
Quote Reply
Posted: 11 Dec 2008 at 3:45pm |
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Your right about the floodlight bases. My 4th of July Water Lights show used, well, a lot of water. I had geysers that shot up into the air, and what goes up must come down... right on top of my floodlights. It was imperative that I had water resistant floodlight bases. Because of the eventual submersion of the extension cords, I also used a lot of electrical tape, and even that failed on me a few times. If it is really a concern, you can add a bit of plumbers putty around the connection then tape that shut, but even then that's nothing more than a gamble. GFCI's are essential, and they saved my butt so many times it's unbelievable.
I like the idea of an inclement weather announcement. I've got a technical difficulties (show back online soon) announcement, and a technical difficulties (show canceled tonight) announcement, so that's makes sense to have that as well. |
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~Jonathan
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LightsOnLogan
Admin Group
Joined: 11 Oct 2007 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3187 |
Quote Reply
Posted: 11 Dec 2008 at 2:36pm |
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IMO, most of these products are designed with exit "weep holes" in mind to let moisture out if it should get in. Sealing those holes runs the risk of trapping moisture which could be less safe than not. That said, some pointers...
Mini lights... low risk except for the plug ends (which seem to be fairly well designed anyway)... each bulb is 2.5V so water in the individual sockets really isn't a big deal. The same goes for LEDs which run in the 2V - 3.5V range per bulb depending on color and manufacturer.
C7/C9/Curtain strobes.. could pose problems. Each bulb gets the full 120V! Most of these have two "weep holes" at the base of the bulb. If power is continually applied anything that does manage to cross the contacts usually vaporizes before any problem can occur. Even in typical wall switched applications, accumulated water will only blow the fuse in the string. In animated applications though, water accumulated in the socket when power isn't applied will cook a triac when the channel switches on. Where possible it is best to orient these with the weep holes down to let gravity do its job.
Flood Lights (Incandescent PAR type, not MR16): The WORST offenders. It is absolutely positively 100% necessary to get very good floodlight holders! The Wal*Mart $2 specials will NOT work in this application. No exceptions! You will need to get something in the $6-$10 range with all metal construction and a very good weather seal around the bulb. IMO, the cheap plastic ones in the $2 range are completely unsafe and should be taken off the market!
Puddles... It should go without saying that the above applies to typical precipitation, not to submersion in puddles. Don't place something where it will become submersed!
Now... everything I just wrote... throw it away! These are products made in China where design and material substitutions without telling anyone are pretty much business as usual. Just because something was designed correctly doesn't mean it ever was made that way!
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peteandvanessa
Beta Testers
Joined: 11 Dec 2007 Location: Rocklin, CA Online Status: Offline Posts: 206 |
Quote Reply
Posted: 11 Dec 2008 at 11:18am |
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I used baggies on a few connections the first year, then used nothing the second year. Both years worked out fine even with rain :-)
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